Firstly, i want to start off my comment to state a few things. I am arab living in the middle east myself, so i am very biased.
Look, i get where you're coming from; i do. But this there's a reason why we have such heavy disagreements. I'm going to comment on a few things, but know i'm not trying to come off as rude or accusative; just trying to discuss.
(I'm going to assume by your use of "democrat" you mean people who desire democracy, and not a US democrat)
And still we can’t stop fighting against each other? No one here supports the rise of what hates this great community. We should stand together and share the spirit described. We certainly do to some extent, but every time we don’t and instead of discussing start fighting against each other, the fascists will jump for joy, since we support their rise
Well, genocide is naturally going to have a lot of fierce debate around it. We can fight zionism and fascism at the same time, we don't have to stop the world for each and every single issue and solve them one by one; we can try to solve multiple.
It’s the ongoing war in Gaza
Genocide*
But let’s not do it in a way that makes fascists to triumph and us to peter out in an endless fight regarding this topic which we can’t really change. There are so many topics we could influence, one of the most obvious being to be a digital alternative to BigTech’s platforms.
I heavily disagree. Apathy is just exploited by the enemy. Even if our total impact is small, it is worth it.
Generally:
The most important Usenet-rule for us: Don’t feed the troll. If it’s obvious that your discussion partner doesn’t want to discuss constructively, don’t answer. The most obvious trolls are those with accounts younger than a week (sometimes just insulting). If such an account appears in a discussion: Ignore + report. It might be a good idea to check the account age before discussing with someone.
What seems obvious is to argue in good faith.
Do not insult anybody, it won’t help you nor anybody else. No lemmy user is a nazi/etc. At least I didn’t see one so far. If you want to insult a lemmy user e.g. as nazi, first calm down, maybe wait some time before responding. If you still want to insult this user, it definitely is the better choice to ignore that user. Calling someone a nazi or insulting in another way is nothing that will help us in any sense. If a user actually advocates nazi ideas, it is a troll. If you want to start insulting: Don’t do it. If it’s a troll: Don’t respond, don’t feed it, just report it and shut up.
Please (!) use sources. If you state something which isn’t your opinion or an obvious fact, don’t say “Uh, I heard it somewhere”, but name a reliable source.
If there’s already an ongoing discussion between two users, only join it if you have something important to say. It’s not very helpful if there are four people discussing with one person at the same time.
I wholeheartedly agree.
What we should definitely agree on is the meaning of “Zionism”. The simple definition I have in mind is: Zionism is to advocate for the foundation of a Jewish national state (as a result of the Jewish experiences during the holocaust and centuries of persecution) and thus the approval for Israel to exist (which is one of the two conditions we need for a 2 state solution). That’s the most common German definition, but it doesn’t really fit e.g. the US-American definition
That's debatable, since zionism is about advocating for an ethnostate. But your latter comment, it not fitting the "US-American" definition is false. It's the most widely used definition. Hell, it's literally the original definition. Zionism is about the Palestine region, not just anywhere.
Why am i bringing this up? Because there were already people there. No matter what, they don't just have a right to establish their own ethnostate, claiming the land where there were already people of different ethnicities/cultures living there for an incredibly long time.
This is afaik about zionism and i may be missing something. So, if i got something wrong here, then please correct me.
What is happening in Gaza to civilians is fucking awful, and not the smartest thing for Israel to do, and some aspects of Israeli military activity may be are war crimes, and it doesn’t have to be genocide for it to be tragic. [As far as I know, meanwhile several international organisations like UN have declared it a genocide, so that part is obsolete.]
"Not the smartest thing to do" is a bit of an understatement, it's a genocide after all
Stop with the fucking history lessons about what the Israelites did, or what the Ottomans did, or what the British did, or whatever. IT IS FUCKING IMMATERIAL. There is a pile of dog shit in the living room. Instead of arguing about whose dog took the bigger shit in the living room, maybe focus on how we clean up the dog shit.
The first thing that should be done first and foremost, is stopping the violence and genocide. But to claim history has absolutely no stake/meaning in this is wrong.
We as Lemmy-users should act as described earlier, constructively discuss the topic. Middle East is one little topic we do not agree on in comparsion to all the great things we can agree on
I'm sure this is worded wrong, but one little topic? There are hundreds of thousands of human beings suffering and dying because of these conflicts, It is not a little topic. This isn't a small disagreement to have with someone.
That's it. Apologies if i sounded rude anywhere, it's 9pm and i'm tired